A
Oh, yeah, I, I agree with it yeah. They will admit to you that they can-, don't have the benefit of being able to you know, of, of, letting, allowing themselves to believe their clients that are guilty --
B
Uh-huh.
A
-- it's more of the game plan of how do they convince the judge or jury through argument.
B
And --
A
That the,
B
-- they are very effective too.